Episode 17: Reduce your energy bills and carbon footprint with high-quality window glazing

On this episode of the Outlier podcast, we’re talking with sustainability enthusiast and owner of Ecosky Windows, Monika Rogers. Ecosky Windows is a relatively new player on the Australian market and is already making a huge impression. Monica is the driving force behind Ecosky and she sits down with us today to tell us about the things that make their fenestration systems unique and why we should consider glazing as one of the top priorities during the construction or renovation of our homes. If you’ve ever wondered what kind of difference higher-quality windows would make in a home, this is the episode for you.

Episode Transcript

Evangelia  00:00

Okay, let’s  get straight to it. Monica, can you tell us exactly what it is that you do? Introduce yourself and eco sky to us and our listeners.


Monika  01:18

Cool. Thanks. Evangelia. So I am Monika, the founder of Ecosky Windows, and we specialize in supplying really high performance, timber frame and aluminium clad double or triple glazed windows. And you said, what led me?


Anthony  01:38

Yeah, I want to hear more about where did your journey start? I know that off air we talked about even as a child and what your dad did and how that may have even been as far back as then is when this all began.


Monika  01:49

Yeah, that’s truth. So I grew up in Europe, and probably going back to my childhood yet, like you, Anthony said, my dad built our own home and obviously a few other projects, but just by building our own home. He chose to use this high-performance timber frame, double-glazed windows. And I just had the benefits of experience, like experience the benefits firsthand if that makes sense.


Anthony  02:21

I mean, one of the things that I was interested in the words that you use was you use the word healthy homes, like your dad was building healthy homes. And you know, this is like, well, before we knew what double glazing was in Australia, a healthy home. Yeah, so


Monika  02:36

I’m talking about like, going back to my childhood, my dad was building healthy homes. And he bought our, our own family home. And we obviously just couldn’t go on Google and research what is healthy home is so so here he chose obviously the right thing. So right ventilation, insulation, and the, like the main most important thing is where I fenestration so he picked that like timber frame, double glazed windows to inst all into our family home. So I think it’s remain, like insulation, ventilation, and obviously, we’re good quality Windows led to have as a super tiny, like bills, energy bills during winter. And obviously it’s almost no bills in summer. And most people were extremely surprised if we used to live in a two bedroom apartment and had a higher bills when in our like three story family home, which is super, super cool.


Anthony  03:35

But so was that even new age, I guess for even at that time for your dad to have that kind of progression? Or was this something that was relatively normal?


Monika  03:45

The windows was a new thing. Because yeah, but then that was definitely a new thing. But even the older house, we actually when I look back, we all been double glazed, just no argon. And just as simple glazing. So actually all over windows going back, I mean, it’s probably 60-70 years, we all had like a timber, just a simple timber frame not engineered. So obviously, it’s not as good for insulation perspective, and all been double glaze. So it’s not a big deal to have a double glazed in that type of climate and going 50-60 years back even.


Anthony  04:26

Wow, I’m fast forwarding, you’ve now decided to go into that side of the industry itself and look at Windows, fenestration, is I suppose we know what led you to this, but it’s clearly your passion. Is this something that you’ve known from very early on, and now that it’s led to you creating your own window company, and not just a window company, but I might let you take it away and talk a bit more about that. Yeah.


Monika  04:55

Yeah, thanks. So it actually was another big factor in my life. I thought I really realize where they have to be more focused about sustainability. And that’s when my son was born. Right? I think when we become a parent, we always think, okay, I want to leave a legacy, I need to lead by example of sustainability just really focus about climate change. And when we move back to Australia, about three years ago, I saw a massive gap in the market for high performance windows with natural materials. Like, as we like Australians, love it timber, everything like Timber Flooring, natural materials, and it wasn’t a product really vet have that high performance window with natural materials. So it just was a clear gap in the market?


Anthony  05:44

Gosh, I would, I would dare to say that it would be 80% or something, probably that aluminium windows in Australia, like the thought of timber was something that was probably foreign to us as it was, even though even though we do have like real love of timber, it’s yeah, I can see why you’ve felt that way.


Monika  06:03

Yeah, and I feel bad. Not. I kind of I felt the need to show this. But basically, it was a gap of education. If that makes sense. It’s not you don’t know what you don’t know. Right? I grew up growing up with that I experienced that vendor for over 30 years. And it’s no, that doesn’t exist. Yes. It’s, I felt really, I have to do something about it.


Anthony  06:26

Yeah, Evangelia, has spent some time in Europe herself. And I’m sure you can agree or test to what your experiences have been like. Yeah, it’s just


Evangelia  06:34

interesting. The level of acceptance is is very similar to what you say you don’t know what you don’t know. So you know, when you are privy to living in a household that has a higher quality glazing, you know, it’s very difficult to come back to the Australian standard. And particularly in my house, I have a circa 1950s weatherboard. Home and the, the glazing, well put it this way, I cracked one just by shutting the window. Well, so yeah, it’s, it’s well depart. You know, the quality of the fenestration and the quality of the internal environment can make a major difference. So I’m very appreciative of high quality fenestration. But can you tell us Monica, in your opinion, what what makes the glazing at Eco sky so unique? And if you like, maybe tell us a little bit about the new values that you can achieve? Particularly with not just the fenestration but the glaze the framing as well.


Monika  07:31

Yeah, so I think it’s important to think about the whole window system as a package as sort of this glazing. And obviously, we, we supply, high-quality double glazing double or triple glazing filled with argon, but I think what makes us really different is our timber frame. Like it’s 98 mil thick timber frame clad with aluminium, which is, yeah, 98 mil thick.


Evangelia  08:00

So in terms of 98 mil thick? What is that Anthony, technically is how different is that to the standard? Just to give the listeners an idea of why is that? What we currently


Anthony  08:13

Well, a single, single-glazed aluminium frame window, might be at best, I don’t know, around 35 millimetres or something like that. And to put in perspective, a standard timber stud in Australia is only 90 millimetres thick. These window frames are thicker than a standard 90 mils timber stud frame.


Monika  08:30

Yeah, so it’s from installation perspective, it’s incredible. If that makes sense. Where U-values we can achieve as if, from a frame perspective. It’s, I can’t I can’t even explain as I incredible what we can achieve. And combined with glazing, like one of the projects we quoting, right now we achieved that point six, nine U-value basically.


Anthony  08:55

Wow. Okay. So give again, some context to what that means, if everyone doesn’t mind, single-glazed, maybe six. If I if I’m like sort of thinking properly, so you’re talking decimals. So you know, this is performing significantly better. Then if we sort of slide down that scale, most double-glazed aluminium Windows systems here might be doing a four-ish, something around that or mid-threes, and then even the UPVC double-glazed systems that we work with quite regularly as well at 1.6. So you’re just Can I get you to just mention the number again, sorry, Monica.


Monika  09:34

Yeah, it was a triple-glazed window and .69.


Anthony  09:39

Okay. Do you know what that converts to approximately as a U-value? Is it insulation though? Like, is it one? Something that’s alright, well, we can do that.


Monika  09:52

By one. It’s not the insulation value?


Anthony  09:56

It’s the inverse of our R-value value here and it differs around the world. So we’ve got to be mindful because even though it’s called R-value in America and R-value here, they’re actually totally different numbers as well. And then yeah, so if we convert the that point six by sort of dividing it by one is the rule of thumb, it’ll kind of give you the inverse, which is the R-value. And we can kind of what we do with that is we compare that against, say, the insulation value of the wall. So we have real life comparisons. And it’s really significant. So if we have a typical 90 mil timber stud wall with an R-2.5 bat in it, and you’ve got, you know, single glazing, aluminium windows, well, you might only have like an R-value of one point. Point six or seven or sorry, no, the other way worse, like point one or two, got this are 2.5 that in the war, but realistically, the window performance is only the equivalent of about our point one or two. Whereas what you’re describing, I think it was closer to an R-value of a whole number of one or higher. Yeah, significant. That is a massive, massive deal.


Monika  11:02

Yeah. And it’s Yeah, and you can feel it actually, you can feel it inside of a house, that is a high-quality glazing installed.


Evangelia  11:10

So having said that, Monica and with your experience with Australian households comparatively speaking to what you’ve moved, what what do you personally, what’s your opinion on the quality of glazing that you see installed? In households residences in Australia? I mean, we can take it!


Monika  11:32

No, like history, historically, is just, I think the vast majority of a house and has, like Anthony said, like, aluminium frame with single glazed window. And I’m not even sure how did we even come up with that? Idea. Obviously, most people save is because of a client but we don’t need a good quality windows. So because it’s always hot. I still don’t I don’t understand how it can came off a bad idea maybe just from a price perspective, or, or not have knowledge and experience of manufacturing a like European style window. And obviously, it’s a lot of mid range double glazed windows versus what I which is like, even funny instead, like aluminum windows with double glazed review value or for something like this. And I think my spear V come in high performance level triple glazed windows or any glazings specifications you need we can achieve it. Yes, I believe it’s like three different areas of Windows. Yeah, currently,


Anthony  12:39

I’m sure it had price had something to do with it initially. And Australia only recently comparatively to the world only recently began to insulate homes and actually even put wraps on and it started to make them a little bit more airtight up until, I mean, most homes and you probably have this in your own home in Mongolia, as I do, but we still have vents in our plasterboard that go to straight to outside air. So they were that was a great idea. We thought ventilating your home, you know, you’ve got fires burning in there, you want to have make sure we got lots of ventilation. So once we start introducing insulation, and we became a little bit more airtight, and we removed those components from our homes, as we started to use electrical heating and cooling devices, we realize that all of a sudden that that aluminium single glazed window is not really a great component to include in that overall system is the surface temperatures always going to be called you know, if there’s a couple of occupants in a bedroom, and during the night, they’ve combined maybe six or seven leaders have transpired and it’s gonna go somewhere and it’s gonna go straight to that cold surface of the aluminium window and it’s going to condensate and then you ended up with mold and all these things now we’re sort of going scratching our heads going why is this happening and the amount of people who still wake up and go why forgot condensation all over my windows on the inside to mind you and they’re getting sick because the indoor air quality is now reduced. Well, actually, you can put a good college window in there, it’s especially timber because that surface temperature is going to be way more consistent to that of the wall. And it’ll it’ll really improve things dramatically. So I think that’s the backstory if I was going to put it in a quick five minute rundown


Monika  14:13

Oh, I had experienced that myself living it while the week made me move back to rent a place for like few months until we bought a house and it was a brand new build and double glazed aluminium windows and it was crazy. I had to have a window open all the time. Yeah, because I didn’t want that condensation and obviously mold in my bathrooms It was what performance old apartment building


Anthony  14:36

that must have been eating away at you because you knew what could be done.


Monika  14:41

So and in winter you have to have a window open. It just doesn’t make sense. Yeah.


Anthony  14:47

It’s not a smart ventilation strategies that the peak of winter you want to conserve energy that you’ll have to open a window to combat these things. But that’s a whole discussion for another day as well. The only other thing I might ask to further to that is, I mean, we’re talking about things that are very much aligned with Passivhaus. And that is, that is a strong movement here in Australia for very good reasons. Because it does tick all these boxes, is this something that you’re also catering for? Because your components, I suppose, are they sort of sort of Passivhaus certified components?


Monika  15:23

Yeah, so a company actually a company about a partnership, from manufacturing perspective, we have, we produced a first Passive House certified window back in Europe in 2000…. Ever that list ever. Wow, we got, we got actual certification back in Austria as a first Passive House windows. But at the moment, our windows are not Passivhaus certified, because we have a company that they work with export to all different markets. And every single market needs a different Passivhaus certification from a climate zone. Okay, let’s be we produce windows of for you values of Yep, we can achieve any values based not any sorry, up to 0.8. But for specific projects, believe we can do it like point six, nine and things like about so we can manufacture and ship Passivhaus certification levels, if that makes sense.


Evangelia  16:19

You mentioned earlier, Monica, that you were a passionate advocate for you know, all things sustainable in the environment. So why is it that you chose fenestration as your weapon for change? What was it that?


Monika  16:33

Yeah, so I probably the the first thing I, like my husband and I ever looked at our own carbon emission footprint, basically. And we only have one car. And then when we moved back to Australia, but basically our biggest carbon emission was our energy consumption consumption at home. And then compare that here or living in Europe. We lived in Luxembourg for a few years. Before we move back. It was all come down to Windows, actually, to high quality windows, because the numbers were shocking. We like why our energy consumption is so high here. Like we couldn’t understand it. So we measure every single thing why? And yeah, it all came back to high quality windows. Another thing is, like Anthony said it was it’s a movement was a passive house building. So people are hungry for high quality windows, high performing windows, and sustainable windows, like from raw materials. So I just wanted to fill that gap. Yeah, and just look basically what I can do on my personal level. From today. Yeah, pushing towards sustainability. Oh, thank


Anthony  17:43

you. Because yeah, I think there are definitely a demand for it here. And it’s always great to have, you know, more options, I suppose for people out there to consider and also to learn from, I dig a bit deeper on the sustainability side of things as well, you mentioned and correct me if I’m wrong, but the your materials are sustainably sourced as well. So the timber Yeah. Would you be able to expand a bit more on that Monica?


Monika  18:05

Yeah, so we, our company has about a partnership, we have a forest stewardship certificate. So for every single tree we call for revenues, we plant another and we everything is just raw, sustainable, because it’s healthy for us. It’s Jehovah throw timber at home. It’s with like timber briefs, and it’s just healthy for people inside of a house, if that makes sense. And it’s healthy for our planet.


Anthony  18:32

Oh, hi. Thanks for taking the time to come and have a look at the hybrid home course it’s been produced by outline studio, and we’ve been working on it for the last 18 months. But we cover all the topics that you’re going to need to be able to upskill and learn a little bit more about how you can have a high performing home. We look at energy efficient housing design in general orientation, air tightness, insulation, ventilation, thermal bridging glazing, and we do touch on costs a little bit too. Although disclaimer, it’s only at the current time of recording that we’ve been able to put those forward. You’ll find everything from as Bill verifications, in which we have our own services and advice, helpful handouts that touch on all of the topics that we discussed. You can see on the left hand side here in the video, we consider things in detail like how we go about recording our heart for shading. We also do some demonstrations on how to achieve better results and annatto as assessment, you’ll see what it looks like when we do our inspections and see the thermal bridging occurring and you can also have a look at a previous presentation from builders declare that we did. We looked at the importance of ventilated cavities and the right reps and moisture control as well as the ventilation systems. thermal bridging is a big one that we touch on and a step by step process of how to install a window. On top of that you’ve got all these fantastic construction details you can use for projects yourselves and in your documentation. We look it up the best practices high performance and even airtight construction as well in these details. So please take the opportunity now to purchase the course you will not regret so I’m going to just ask a few questions to get a better understanding of like, what the products are capable of, and maybe some of the integrations into those as well because I’m sure by now some certain people like uninstall windows from my home or my building. Tell me all the I know when it comes to timber species in Australia, where it particularly in regional areas or regions that have bushfire management overlays, this is something that you’re able to provide an outside skin of aluminium to then make the certification or meet the requirements of a noncombustible.


Monika  20:29

So yes, correct. Anthony, we can do both. Now. Yes, correct. We can provide that with as our vendors come in two different types either timber window, inside and outside. And another option is timber window cladded with aluminium from outside, which is obviously a bushfire safe, and we can put any glazing to work with a bushfire rating if his belt Well, Bell 90 Annabelle, even 29 Actually even belt we can achieve up to about 40. Wow, six mil toughened glass, yep.


Anthony  21:05

Yeah, that’s amazing. Yeah, there’s not too many timber windows I’m aware of the comcan meet a BAL-40. So that’s really helpful. The I mean, let’s talk flyscreens insects and bugs are a big thing in Australia. So that’s another thing that you’ve been able to tackle.


Monika  21:22

Yeah, so and I actually really love our flyscreens is just from an aesthetic point of view. Like just a nice feature as we have retractable flyscreen, which is,


Evangelia  21:34

how does that work? Yeah, explain


Anthony  21:35

that. How does that work?


Monika  21:36

Yeah. So that’s the first thing from a static point of view of a frame comes same color, like as your alum. Like I said, the no color from outside. So you can even see that flyscreen is attached. And then you need a fly screen somewhere. It just, you just tracks down basically. And then you don’t need it. It goes


Anthony  21:57

it in a way that’s all integrated into the door. And when Yeah, yeah, it’s, it’s really cool. And external. Okay, so two more things, because we’re going to dive into National Construction Code changes now. So they’re getting close, although that just in the last 24 hours, we have seen a little bit of an announcement saying that there’s going to be another 12 month grace period for this, but I’m sure for most people who are listening, they’re pretty much like, Hey, we’re ready to go now. So I think we’ve touched on the energy efficiency side of things fairly in depth. So big tick. The second one is liveability. So we need to be able to provide zero threshold entries. And I may have missed remember this, but you have like integrated strip train systems and things are such that can go on the outside of the doors for border management that allow pretty much zero threshold entries.


Monika  22:42

Yeah, exactly. So we have opened doors with 05 mil thresholds. And they all have a sliding systems comes with an integrated water drain it is integrated, right and correct. Yeah. So it’s super cool.


Anthony  23:00

Amazing. Yeah. And the other one, I mean, I guess I’m kind of asking that because I’m, I guess I’m fairing on this a little bit, because I’m really impressed with the product. And I can see all the integrations and I’m like, This is amazing. So apologies for those who are listening or going come on, get to the point. But external shading as well as massive when we have here type buildings, particularly in Passivhaus. So again, one of the biggest issues that we have with this is when aesthetically integrating in external shutters or blinds for protection against the sun entering into the home and causing overheating. That’s another thing I think I noted that you can also do is have external shading. Particularly vertical blinds are what I’m most interested in. And they can be a fabric as opposed to a solid as well. Is this another thing that can be done?


Monika  23:43

Yes, correct. Anthony Yeah, we work because we work with most most most of our projects, our architectural projects, and obviously aesthetics is a quite a big thing. And yeah, we can provide external blinds external awnings. Red is only for this only supplementing with Windows, if that makes sense. I don’t want to be a blind business or something like this. It’s just, it’s just for people. Okay, let’s I have a project and I really need a different blind or something. Yes, let’s work together. And we can we have a big range of, of blinds. And basically,


Anthony  24:18

I think your product already meets all of the requirements of all the new National Construction Code requirements, I guess, that are coming into effect very soon. So that’s also something that’s challenging for certain suppliers or manufacturers is, hey, our products used to tick the box. But now we’ve got to reassess this and look at how we’re going to alter this to meet the new requirements or new regulations. come October 23, or it could be later we’ll find out soon enough. Is there anything further that you think that you’ve, I suppose, looking to implement in your product range, anything new and exciting that’s on the horizon or anything that might be to address the new National Construction Code?


Monika  24:58

Yeah, no, that’s Anthony. I’m just happy as well, but their National Construction Code is changing, and it’s getting better. And hopefully it’s gonna get pushed more towards passive home style building. And so from our point of view, windows, what we provide is not gonna, nothing is gonna change, we are very proud what the product we can, we can offer. But I think thinking on Education of consumers will change. And, yeah, and which is a huge thing, and probably it’s gonna be bigger, like a big is probably more important for people even middle range, double glazed windows. But hopefully some people will say that let’s get the high performance support based on those, if that makes sense.


Anthony  25:41

Absolutely. I mean, in my experience, doing energy ratings, and phpp is the one thing that you can absolutely incorporate into a design that will just drastically improve the energy rating or the results for certification for phpp as well. So yeah, it’s I can agree with that for certain, I think gone are the days of those single glazed aluminium windows in our climate cooler climate zones, at least anyway.


Monika  26:07

Yeah. And yeah, you will never regret by choosing the highest quality product you can get, like, you’re just not going to regret.


Evangelia  26:15

And that actually leads into the next question I wanted to ask. And I mean, I know there may be a little bit of bias flying around, obviously, but you know, it, when should clients consider, you know, sort of prioritizing quality fenestration in a in a project? Because quite often, what we see is that, you know, sometimes client can be really sort of fixed on some nicer finishes, or different components of a building. And fenestration can be pushed back down on that sort of priority list in terms of spending the money is that, you know, when should they sort of take a step back and say, Look, really, we want this building to be performing at its highest level and still look beautiful? You know, in your opinion, should that be at the top of the priority list? Obviously, it should be?


Monika  26:58

Yeah, yes. Yes. Anthony’s laughing? Yes. I think it should be, but you know, it’s a lot of like, if it takes them back. And I think it’s a lot of like, cost of living precious at the moment. And for people just think about the cost, obviously. But I think that for basically, you never have, you shouldn’t save money on a good quality fenestration. Never ever, as good quality fenestration makes a good quality building. And actually, by the end, I like it, when it’s gonna save you money on energy bills, like it will be better for you, if you invest now. And most people actually are extremely surprised if we’re looking at a middle middle range, like double glazed windows, it’s actually not as such a big job to get a high performance that workplace windows from a cost perspective. So yeah, most people are really surprised and really happy that we explored another option.


Anthony  27:57

But this is a discussion that is just it’s just, it’s evolving so quickly, that when’s the payback period for these things, you know, the cost to value ratio, so to speak. And I mean, they’re indicating energy pricing is doubling again, within a very short period of time. So that that cost to value ratio, it’s it’s shortening very quickly. And unfortunate, I guess our mindset is a little bit juvenile in Australia, maybe comparatively to others around the world. And we kind of making those decisions now, like just based on a cost perspective, rather than thinking about, hey, we’re gonna be living in this house in 10 years time, what the hell energy pricing price is going to be like them? We’re not, I don’t know, if we I don’t think I’ve ever sat down. And the first thing I’ve spoken about is forecasting for what the cost of operating and cooling and heating our homes going to be. It’s more about, Hey, would that cost you? I can do that myself, you know, that seems to be more the approach that we have. And that’s, as you say, I think that’s going to be something that’s going to change quite quickly in our country, given the climate that we’re in at the moment, given those pressures, external pressures that we’ve we’re feeling. I mean, this is a thing that we talk about quite often windows and glazing and fenestration in the office. And we do have that thought or mentality that, hey, spend more money on the Windows glazing package, and maybe look at reducing some of the finished materials in areas that you won’t see, you know, does the guest bathroom really need to have the high-end Stone finishes, or you could just maybe put something that’s a little bit more affordable in there and spend that remaining money on your window package, which is going to benefit you from now until, you know, well into the future?


Evangelia  29:38

I think there’s something to be said also, about having those tangible examples, because there’s not an awful lot. I mean, personally, I don’t know that many people that have a high-functioning home with, you know, high-level fenestration. And if I did, you know, each time I go there and experience that quality internal environment, I’d probably think yeah, I definitely put that high on my priority list, but unfortunately, the standard here is probably not quite there yet. Well, generally speaking,


Anthony  30:06

Monica, you’re taking both the boxes aesthetically pleasing and performing.


Evangelia  30:13

Yeah, thank you. So are we thinking of asking the last? Are we okay to ask that we


Anthony  30:19

have to ask the last question we don’t mind if you really speak your mind on this last question is one that we asked every single guest. And I guess it kind of blended into to make sure that you’ve got a bit more flexibility in which way you want to approach the answer. Do you want to take this one Evangelia? Yes.


Evangelia  30:34

So are we asking as we’ve got it, or did you have something else in mind? Okay, so Monika. Yes, you had one wish to change something in the NCC? Or in the industry? What would it be?


Monika  30:50

Less? Thank you for this great question. I think it would be a couple of things. And I think the most important thing for everyone who’s thinking of building a home in a future would be we would have a push towards a passive home, at least design of principles built. So that will be a better Building for Everyone. Right and for for us and the environment. And obviously, I believe we about possibly documentation of installation process


Anthony  31:26

that we can not forget the importance of this.


Monika  31:28

The insulation and you know, a good quality slab about installation basically, of process. So yeah, passive, passive home passive home and eco friendly homes, which obviously have all double glazed windows and high performance subordinative In Windows, because it’s very big difference between double glazed midrange double glazed windows and high performance glazed windows.


Anthony  31:53

Well, I mean, yeah, it’s a very logical response to hear that from yourself. Totally agree. Yeah, it would be amazing to have a set requirement in a National Construction Code, I think that, I guess forces that a little bit more to occur as well. So maybe some medium performance values for glazing, that would be helpful. But yeah, it’s the, I suppose I’d love for people to get to get in contact with you to Monica. You know, how do people go about finding you? What’s the best method to do? So? How can they find more information on the product as well?


Monika  32:27

So we actually have a quite, newish website launched the a month ago. So it’s the best way just to jump on our website is Ico Sky dot Comdata. You and yeah, we will find most of information. And it’s, it’s a contact button yet you can send an email to us and we super friendly team. And yes, we’ll get back to you very, very soon.


Anthony  32:48

And is there any operational samples that I suppose people can have get access to? Have you gotten anyone in Adelaide or thereabouts, I know that I’m going to put my hand up and request some of that moving forward. So anyone who’s interested to have a look, they can drop by our office and have a look. So


Monika  33:03

yeah, so we, our basically our home is our home is actually our kind of display home for our window, so people can come like contact us by appointment only, and we have people coming through. And in the future, we’re gonna have some samples as well. Like, do you have any a few other people who would like some? Yeah, not that some problem at all?


Anthony  33:26

Well, yeah, it’s wonderful. Thank you, Monica. I mean, yeah. Immediately upon, when we first met and chatted, like it was quite evident how passionate you were about doing better. And I can see massive things for yourself moving forward. I mean, the product is exceptional. The performance is, you know, through the roof and you yourself, speak volumes for where this is going to move for you. And I encourage anyone who’s looking at timber, or timber le cloud options for their window or pleasing packages to definitely reach out to you. There’s no limitations on where they can be delivered or anything as such is


Monika  34:02

now we provider Australia wide. Yeah, no problems. me speaking with the guys in Tasmania as well. So it’s, yeah, it’s everywhere. As a shipping port we can deliver.


Anthony  34:13

We’ve had no problems being an island in Australia. So


Evangelia  34:17

wonderful. Thank you so much, Monica, for your time and taking time out of your busy schedule. Really appreciate it.


Monika  34:23

Thank you for having us.


Anthony  34:24

It’s been a pleasure. Thanks, Monica.


Evangelia  34:26

Thank you. Thank you for listening to the outlier podcast. You can find helpful links and contact information regarding this episode in our show notes and on our website, outlier studio.com.au forward slash podcast. If you like our show, please leave a review and make sure you subscribe to never miss a new episode. If you have further questions for us or want to share some additional feedback, please feel free to DM us on Instagram or Facebook. Until next time on the outlier podcast You